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 Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology

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Chrom
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PostSubject: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Thu Nov 06, 2014 5:56 pm


Fallon Fox wrote:

I still get some MMA fans contacting me saying something along the lines of, "Joe Rogan said_______. You tranny!". "Saw you on Joe Rogan's show. He's right, you are a man!" "The surgery doesn't take away your bone density! You tranny! Joe Rogan said so!". All of that would just be whispers in my ear if it wasn't for people contacting me saying that they want to create a petition to give to - who knows? - to try to keep me from doing my job, and throwing some of Joe Rogans bogus arguments and slurs at me when they do. It wouldn't bother me that much if what he's putting out there was not affecting my career. In my opinion he is the instigator of much of the unwarranted animosity thrown my way by many MMA fans. In my opinion he is spreading misinformation about my body in relation to my job.
Perhaps I would have not said anything ever. But, it's been almost a year and I haven't heard a retraction, or any kind of public apology. He could do so and that would be really - really nice. He has the chance to clear all of this up and not look like such a jerk. He has a podcast that he runs which reaches the ears of millions. But, he does happen to do commentary on UFC fights. And my opinion is that correcting what he has said would look good for the UFC and others who work with Joe Rogan. It's highly probable that the UFC as an organization - along with other entities that work with him - may not necessarily hold the exact same stance as Rogan?
If I were to ever be signed with the UFC, having Rogan as a commentator during my fight would be... awkward to say the least. I'm a viable female fighter. In my opinion, from my personal perspective, what Joe Rogan has said amounts to some kind of public harassment. Im looking to try to make it on a UFC show. But, I have to deal with someone who works with that show being publicly transphobic. If Rogan were to say racist comments I would feel the same way, if he were to say homophobic comments same thing. I think that's understandable.
Since I've come out, Joe Rogan continues to spread incorrect information on transgender athletes. Much of this goes against the consensus of the medical community and the commissions that license me to fight. I see no end to this from him in sight. In one of his more recent podcast he said, "But the big difference is the mechanical advantage of the male frame. You don’t find a female with super wide shoulders, narrow waist and the same size hips and the same shape hips as a man and when you have that kind of body you can just generate more force." I still haven't heard what this claim is based on other than his bias and guessing. How does that work exactly? If it were such a thing I would get licensed.
He has influence with MMA fans. So, I am forced to focus on Rogan and his arguments now, and will continue to do so for several weeks - or as long as it takes. Like I said, I shouldn't have to do this. But, I feel compelled to do so in order to try to stop this nonsense if I am to attempt to fight in the future for the promotion for which he is a commentator.
It's been a while now since I've come out. My mind needed some time to acclimate to all of this which has made my MMA game a lot tighter lately. And fighting back politically makes me feel even better.  It's tragic really for Joe Rogan and those people who side with him. All of this 'being corrected' can just be avoided by him apologizing and correcting the misinformation. That would really make my day.


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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Thu Nov 06, 2014 6:28 pm

let them bang bro lol!
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Thu Nov 06, 2014 7:35 pm

So what exactly should he apologize for? Voicing his opinion? He's making an observation, not being transphobic or whatever the fuck this guy is trying to say. You don't get to take a simple observation by someone and label it phobic just because it suits your agenda better.

Fuck it. I don't care. I'm not giving this blatantly contentious nonsense any more of my time than i already have.

The day you apologize to all those women you beat up while lying to the athletic commissions about your medical history may be the day Rogan could consider revising his statements. Prboably not though, bro.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 7:48 am

Triggerman99 wrote:
So what exactly should he apologize for? Voicing his opinion? He's making an observation, not being transphobic or whatever the fuck this guy is trying to say. You don't get to take a simple observation by someone and label it phobic just because it suits your agenda better.

Fuck it. I don't care. I'm not giving this blatantly contentious nonsense any more of my time than i already have.

The day you apologize to all those women you beat up while lying to the athletic commissions about your medical history may be the day Rogan could consider revising his statements. Prboably not though, bro.

This.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 9:38 am

if anybody owes anybody an apology it should Fallon Fox for trying to make mma into a 3 ring circus with this bullshit!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 9:40 am

"If I were to ever be signed with the UFC, having Rogan as a commentator during my fight would be... awkward to say the least. I'm a viable female fighter. In my opinion, from my personal perspective,"


hahahahahahahahahaha you really think the UFC will ever hire you? hahahahahahahahahahahaha
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 1:35 pm

Gecko wrote:
if anybody owes anybody an apology it should Fallon Fox for trying to make mma into a 3 ring circus with this bullshit!!!!

What I don't get is why the athletic commissions allow this. I have not seen anyone with a biological background come out and say anything other than it is a MAJOR advantage for a fighter to go through puberty as a man to fight against people who went through puberty as a woman.

This is purely for attention/publicity on Fox's part and I just don't see why the athletic commissions are continuing to let someone with male DNA fight someone with female DNA. If Fox wants to fight in MMA as a transvestite that's great, but do it against fighters that also posses a Y chromosome.

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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 2:13 pm

isnt it bizarre that he didnt start mma until he had a sex change..
to me that is just weird.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 4:35 pm

"Bogus Arguments"

Like the bone structure, mass & density differences-



&

http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-difference-between-the-male-and-female-skeletal-systems.htm

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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 5:00 pm











what a sham of a video... that dude is crazy and so are all the people in his life...

and here is a pic of fallon at 60 years old







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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 5:23 pm

OMG Fox sounds just like chyna from the WWE. Now that's scary!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 5:56 pm

he's got nice tits affraid Puke
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 6:10 pm

norcalmatt wrote:
he's got nice tits affraid  Puke


lol! lol! lol!
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 9:53 pm

So, I guess, this is the last and strongest bastion of phobias. I am not arguing if she should fight in women's division, I am arguing against misconceptions about trans people, and that is what
fallon was talking about. Rogan is usually an awesome dude but this time he is not right and i think is talking out of prejudice.
It is not that hard to google information these days and he, just like the rest of us, should do it before speaking.
Calling her a man is simply insensitive and to a degree, ignorant. A person went through the hardest thing that exists - a complete identity change. none of us can imagine it, we as a society are just now starting to empathize with gays, but this is still out of the realm of allowed possibilities. You think coming out as gay is hard? try changing everything about your self, and know that everyone will hate you.
She identifies as a woman and i will only call her a woman.
she went through physical changes including hormone therapy and surgery and before speaking that she has an advantage, I and the rest of us must educate ourselves. For example:

http://www.nos.org.uk/document.doc?id=1369

http://www.salon.com/2013/06/30/debunking_unfair_advantage_myths_about_trans_athletes_partner/
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Fri Nov 07, 2014 10:51 pm

At this point, for me anyway, it's not even really about him having an unfair advantage (yes, I said him. You say he identifies himself as a woman and therefore should be addressed as such, but I disagree. But that's beside my point).
My big problem with this person is that he is A) unapologetically dishonest, as evidenced by his blatant lying to the athletic commissions for quite some time and seemingly sees absolutely nothing wrong with that, and B) a troublemaking drama queen, as evidenced by him constantly picking fights with and demanding apologies from anyone and everyone in the media who doesn't completely disregard the fact that he used to be a man, and if they don't do so, then he automatically labels them transphobic (which seems pretty ironic coming from someone who seems to have such a problem with labels, doesn't it?)
In short, the fact that he was born a man and now professionally fights women is secondary. The fact the he's a humongous piece of shit as a human being is the real problem, IMO.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Sat Nov 08, 2014 12:53 am

whatever problems you might have with her professionally, i will not argue, but as i said, to insist on calling her a he shows lack of understanding and empathy. seeing sex that you are born with as a final destination is plainly not understanding how we developed as humans and how our genetics work. Sorry, but that is true. and also, I understand where the attitude of disliking her comes from, but i differentiate problems.
if any of you saw what any of these people go through, i believe you would change your opinion, unless of course, your belief system is very rigid. I have, and it seems like a struggle like nothing else.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Sat Nov 08, 2014 3:16 am

Triggerman99 wrote:
At this point, for me anyway, it's not even really about him having an unfair advantage (yes, I said him. You say he identifies himself as a woman and therefore should be addressed as such, but I disagree. But that's beside my point).
My big problem with this person is that he is A) unapologetically dishonest, as evidenced by his blatant lying to the athletic commissions for quite some time and seemingly sees absolutely nothing wrong with that, and B) a troublemaking drama queen, as evidenced by him constantly picking fights with and demanding apologies from anyone and everyone in the media who doesn't completely disregard the fact that he used to be a man, and if they don't do so, then he automatically labels them transphobic (which seems pretty ironic coming from someone who seems to have such a problem with labels, doesn't it?)
In short, the fact that he was born a man and now professionally fights women is secondary. The fact the he's a humongous piece of shit as a human being is the real problem, IMO.

I'm the exact opposite, I really don't care at all what her motives are or how honest of a person she is. What I do care about is that someone with a Y chromosome is allowed to fight someone who does not possess one. I think she has every right to fight in MMA it should just be against fighters who also possess a Y chromosome. If not what is the point in separating the two genders in the first place and not strictly going be weight?

I understand that she mentally identifies with woman and I'm completely ok with that, but physically her body identifies with men, even if she has had her testicals removed and takes hormone supplements to chemically alter her chemical makeup. To me, forcing female fighters to face her in physical combat because she mentally identifies with them just doesn't make sense. It's just too great of an advantage which is why mental compItions are typically not gender specific while physical ones are.

You can call me transgender-phobic if you want (you would be wrong though), or say that I have no empathy for her, but what about having empathy for the female MMA fighters who are forced to fight someone who's body identifies more naturally with a man in order to move up in their promotion.


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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Sat Nov 08, 2014 3:33 am

the commie wrote:
So, I guess, this is the last and strongest bastion of phobias. I am not arguing if she should fight in women's division, I am arguing against misconceptions about trans people, and that is what
fallon was talking about. Rogan is usually an awesome dude but this time he is not right and i think is talking out of prejudice.
It is not that hard to google information these days and he, just like the rest of us, should do it before speaking.
Calling her a man is simply insensitive and to a degree, ignorant. A person went through the hardest thing that exists - a complete identity change. none of us can imagine it, we as a society are just now starting to empathize with gays, but this is still out of the realm of allowed possibilities. You think coming out as gay is hard? try changing everything about your self, and know that everyone will hate you.
She identifies as a woman and i will only call her a woman.
she went through physical changes including hormone therapy and surgery and before speaking that she has an advantage, I and the rest of us must educate ourselves. For example:

http://www.nos.org.uk/document.doc?id=1369

http://www.salon.com/2013/06/30/debunking_unfair_advantage_myths_about_trans_athletes_partner/

I don't think either of those links really make a good argument one way or another. The first basically says that bone density is developed during child hood and that transgendered people are more at risk for osteoporosis do to their reliance on hormones (which is more of a a long term issue).

The other is written a bit more like an opinion piece by someone with no scientific background. The article only summarizes research in which the author conducted (which I did not see a cite for but I could be wrong) and just kind of says that transgender females lose muscle due to less testosterone in their system but it does not quantify it to the difference in muscle tone that is developed by a XX female. It also just kind of says everyone's bone mass is different based on sex, race and DNA and really draws no real solid conclusions regarding transgender females.

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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Sat Nov 08, 2014 4:38 am

the commie wrote:
whatever problems you might have with her professionally, i will not argue, but as i said, to insist on calling her a he shows lack of understanding and empathy. seeing sex that you are born with as a final destination is plainly not understanding how we developed as humans and how our genetics work.

All other points of debate aside, I wholeheartedly disagree with you on this.
To write my opinion off as misunderstanding or ignorance is a cop out. My opinion is my opinion, just like your opinion is your opinion. But don't try to minimize my opinion by labeling it as a lack of understanding or ignorance.
I think that calling someone a man who was born a man is as logical as anything. Maybe you disagree, but you don't see me questioning your understanding of a stranger's mindset and accusing you of lacking knowledge, do you?

Lets just keep opinion and fact in their own separate places, shall we?

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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:10 am

Grey Suit wrote:


the commie wrote:
So, I guess, this is the last and strongest bastion of phobias. I am not arguing if she should fight in women's division, I am arguing against misconceptions about trans people, and that is what
fallon was talking about. Rogan is usually an awesome dude but this time he is not right and i think is talking out of prejudice.
It is not that hard to google information these days and he, just like the rest of us, should do it before speaking.
Calling her a man is simply insensitive and to a degree, ignorant. A person went through the hardest thing that exists - a complete identity change. none of us can imagine it, we as a society are just now starting to empathize with gays, but this is still out of the realm of allowed possibilities. You think coming out as gay is hard? try changing everything about your self, and know that everyone will hate you.
She identifies as a woman and i will only call her a woman.
she went through physical changes including hormone therapy and surgery and before speaking that she has an advantage, I and the rest of us must educate ourselves. For example:

http://www.nos.org.uk/document.doc?id=1369

http://www.salon.com/2013/06/30/debunking_unfair_advantage_myths_about_trans_athletes_partner/



I don't think either of those links really make a good argument one way or another.  The first basically says that bone density is developed during child hood and that transgendered people are more at risk for osteoporosis do to their reliance on hormones (which is more of a a long term issue).  

The other is written a bit more like an opinion piece by someone with no scientific background.  The article only summarizes research in which the author conducted (which I did not see a cite for but I could be wrong) and just kind of says that transgender females lose muscle due to less testosterone in their system but it does not quantify it to the difference in muscle tone that is developed by a XX female.  It also just kind of says everyone's bone mass is different based on sex, race and DNA and really  draws no real solid conclusions regarding transgender females.

^^ What he said.
I did a google search as the commie suggested... the results weren't the ones he came up with. I found multiple solid scientific studies saying exactly the opposite as those "puff pieces"...

What this really comes down to, at least for this forum, is MMA, not if Fallon relates to/as a woman, not if x fighter likes to take dick in his off time, not whether or not x fighter is gay or bi.

What matters here is the possible/probable/already proven danger of allowing a trans-fighter to fight non-trans fighters. Personal choice/lives have no point here. IMO

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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:36 am

cutting your penis off doesnt make you a woman. getting breast implants doesnt make you a woman. taking pills and all this therapy doesnt make you a woman. call me insensitive and i wont care. call me ignorant and i still wont care. tell me i dont know the problems of this transgender mma fighter and ill tell you this transgender mma fighter doesnt know the struggles of my life. but no matter how you cut it this is a truck driving, us military trained man who chopped off his penis, got breast implants, and hair transplants then decided to jump in a cage to fight women. i wonder what this discussion would be like if it was reversed and fallon was born a woman and decided to become a man at 185 pounds and this person was trying to fight people like luke rockhold,jacare or any fighter for that matter. what would people say about that?

the fact that this man started fighting after he had his sex change done is what is really disturbing to me. maybe im wrong in saying this but it seems like he is trying to get a movie/book or something bigger out of this because he is smart enough to know that the media would pick this up immediately.

comparing transgender to lesbian and gay people is just insane. you are born gay/lesbian you arent born transgender thats something you choose to do and you have to accept what society will dish out the same way if you decide to get tattoos all over your body or piercing all over your body.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:09 am

http://au.ibtimes.com/articles/572472/20141112/fallon-fox-transgender-challenges-rousey-joe-rogan.htm#.VGTG6mdFpIY


Oh man, if you guys have a min. you should this article. Fox has really gone off the deep end with this one.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:24 am

this guy needs to chill....

i would love to see him fight that other guy cyborg tho.. cant lie.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Thu Nov 13, 2014 11:35 am

drainbamage wrote:
this guy needs to chill....

i would love to see him fight that other guy cyborg tho.. cant lie.


I would love to see that fight. A poster on one of the fox articles came up with a good point. If Fox really does believe that there is no real advantage to what fox is doing than why hasnt fox fought any men as well? I mean according to Fox there is no difference so why not fight a dude then? Or as another poster put it. What if Cowboy cerrone decided to get a boob job can cowboy and fox fight then?Does that give cowboy the right to fight women because he decided to get boobs? We both know fox wouldnt take that fight and why not?

answer is simple because in all those cases fox would not have an advantage any more.Heck as it stands now Fox is a mediocre wmma fighter as is with the advantage. imagine how fox would look if Fox took on men.
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   Thu Nov 13, 2014 4:38 pm

So Fallon Fox figured out how to work the Google on the internet machine and found some graphs about bone density, and that's supposed to trump the opinions of basicly every educated and accredited physician who says he has an unfair advantage over women in an MMA fight?

Well boy, I guess we all should feel pretty stupid right about now, shouldn't we?
Rolling Eyes


*edit* Oh, and by the way, I did read Fox's editorial on Bloody Elbow, even though I'm a naive, uneducated bigot who doesn't take the time to hear him out, like he seems to think every person who disagrees with him is. And I found a familiar sentiment that Fox keeps going back to over and over again, and that I've pointed out over and over again:

Quote :
I dare either Joe Rogan or Ronda Rousey to express the opinion publicly that black women should be segregated in a fighting class of their own because of their bone density. Perhaps they would if it were socially acceptable to do so for entertainment value, or to keep a black opponent away because of fear of a potential loss, I don't know.

Quote :
But, I feel that it's possible that it's just too late in the game to unnecessarily and unjustly sensationalize bogus advantage claims in this way. But, not too late in the game to feel naively safe in doing this to transgender women. After all, who would listen to our complaints? We're transgender women.

Quote :
Is this starting to look like people with knee jerk reactions who could have taken the time to dig and get correct information, but did not?
That because I am a transgender woman they may feel that they can get away with it because of the transphobia that exists in the world?

Once again, right back to the old standby;
If you diasgree with Fallon Fox, you are transphobic. That's it. No gray area.
If you disagree with him, it's not because you are trying to keep things fair. It's not because you are looking out for the safety of the women he competes against.
It's because you are transphobic.
Shame on you!

Rolling Eyes
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PostSubject: Re: Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology   

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Fallon Fox: Joe Rogan owes me an apology
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